Milagros Gonzales: 0:00

CX is that team that is that eyes and ears inside your brand. So if you have like a magnificent campaign, they will be the first one to receive their praises and like read the fabulous feedback and if something goes wrong or like your clients don't like it, they will be the first ones to hear as well.

Rick Denton: 0:25

You're listening to CX Passport, the show about creating great customer experiences with a dash of travel talk. Each episode we’ll talk with our guests about great CX, travel...and just like the best journeys, explore new directions we never anticipated. I'm your host Rick Denton. I believe the best meals are served outside and require a passport. Let's get going. Welcome back CX passport travelers today we get to head to a new destination which is always exciting for me. Today for the first time we have a guest from Argentina, which is also a country I've not had the chance to see it now soon, I hope meet Mili Gonzalez, a brand business and content specialists with over nine years of expertise navigating what is an incredibly complex landscape of national and multinational companies. Mili currently steers the ship as the ambassador Marketing Manager at Gorgias , where innovation meets personalized support in this vast sea of E commerce. Before Gorgias Mili showcased her strategic prowess at social native donning the hat of Senior Content Curation manager, managing content curation strategies for over 20 accounts and the Emir region now, you're hearing that global reach again. She orchestrated the perfect Symphony between brands and user generated content, ensuring that only the best made it to the forefront for campaigns and launches. Mealies global experience doesn't stop there having served at allI Corp as the International Business Development Manager, responsible for five brands all across Latin America Amelie orchestrated 360 degree growth projects, both from concept all the way to product development, ensuring the seamless customer experience. I came to know Mili through a former CX password guest Zoe Khan, Episode 143. If you haven't already, be sure and go have a listen to her episode as it was absolutely fantastic. Travelers get ready for an enlightening conversation with Mili Gonzalez as she shares insights, experiences and strategies that have shaped her journey in the ever evolving landscape of customer experience. Mili, welcome to CX passport.

Milagros Gonzales: 2:46

Thank you so much for that amazing presentation. That might have been the best presentation of my whole thing. So

Rick Denton: 2:53

Well, good. All right, Episode over. We're just gonna end it here. That's great. We'll publish it. listeners. I hope you enjoyed the show. But no, Meili, there's way too much that you know, that I want to learn from, and I want our listeners to learn from as well. There's something that you said when you and I first met. And I didn't go deep then because I wanted to explore it here in the show, you mentioned that we're in this midst of a transition from knowledge to experience. I'm really curious, what did you mean by that? And how does that influence the practice of customer experience today?

Milagros Gonzales: 3:24

Yeah, like I think like true wisdom is really, you can really put that in practice. When you get into experience. I think like in this era, it's all about the experience and not so much about the educational background. And I think we're going to see that evolving even more in the upcoming generations. Like it's all about experience have you had what you can bring to the table? I'm not about that much about that papers that can back you up. Like that's the really like, I feel it's been changing for the last like, probably 10 years or so. So I didn't remember I say that, but it speaks to my, to what I believe in. So yeah,

Rick Denton: 4:07

well, and really one of the things that impressed me when we were first meeting is exactly that, that I didn't get the sense of calculated it wasn't okay, here are the points that I want to share. These are just the phrases that flowed from you. So if, if we're thinking about both the delivery of customer experience, those of us that are in the customer experience space, or those of us that are around the customer experience space. And if we think of customers, if that's true, if the check of a a particular document, or a degree or a certification is not as important as it is the experience that someone has gained, how does that then influence the delivery of customer experience?

Milagros Gonzales: 4:51

Yeah, I think like that, a being able to we I think we also talk about how important is empathy inside customer experience. Time that customer experience world, like we have to empathize with our clients journey and understand what they're going through what they're looking for when they come to our brands to look for our products. So I think like being able to put on these people shoes and understand their needs, and actually been there, and answering their questions and providing solutions, even before they know, like, even before they have the questions. Yeah, that is what makes a true great experience for the client, right? Like, make it smooth, make it easy, make it approachable. Make it lay, like, not really true, right? Like we all have, like every company has policies, and that we all need like a framework and a structure to know like where how can we be flexible, but there's very important to be able to be flexible and and that's why we have like at the end of the day, we have like a person behind behind support right like right AI right now being so relevant in the conversation and like so many people like I think that were a little over that by people being afraid of like losing their job we talk about this as well like how like Bravo CX is going to be one of the last jobs that can be replaced because at one point to be able to solve problems you need that person behind to be able to understand to make the questions tend to make decisions that are out of policy. So I think let's

Rick Denton: 6:36

oh no keep going sorry. Listeners we have a lag between Argentina and the US it happens really keep going with your flow sorry about that. That's

Milagros Gonzales: 6:43

why like the true CX is like a human experience and it's just empathizing factor of up CX.

Your CX Passport Captain: 6:52

This is your captain speaking. I want to thank you for listening to CX Passport today. We’ve now reached our cruising altitude so I’ll turn that seatbelt sign off. <ding> While you’re getting comfortable, hit that Follow or Subscribe button in your favorite podcast app so you never miss an episode. I’d love it if you’d tell a friend about CX Passport and leave a review so that others can discover the show as well. Now, sit back and enjoy the rest of the episode.

Rick Denton: 7:18

Okay, let's let's talk about that. There's, there's something else I want to ask you. But I'm going to skip that for a second because I want to get into this, this focus on that empathy. You're describing that humanity that flexibility, you and I are very aligned when it comes to placing an emphasis on the frontline. I've heard you say that the customer service the customer service role, the frontline is undervalued. If everything that you just said about empathy, all that is so important. Why do you think the frontline is still today so undervalued?

Milagros Gonzales: 7:51

Is true is true, like I find I see x is that team that is that eyes and ears inside your brand. So if you have like a magnificent campaign, they will be the first one to receive their praises and like read the fabulous feedback. And if something goes wrong, or like your clients don't like it, they will be the first ones to hear as well. So they will they're not only like a support, and problem solving roll, they also have a lot of feedback and a lot of insights from the customers. But I think just right now founders are like shifting their perspective and giving like a proper seat to CX on like that directory table and to make decisions. Because actually CX inside the company is the voice of the customers. So if you want to have like a customer centric culture that we all talk about this and all brands want to be customer centric, you actually need to give a space to to CX in those decisions, because they will be able they will be the ones to be able to speak your customer's mind, because they are the ones that are right there.

Rick Denton: 9:02

I want to I definitely want to go back to something that you said in there. And it is this this idea that the frontline is the one that knows they're the ones that have that interview. And you may have seen me grinning from ear to ear because it is so true that when something and especially in some of the companies like when we were talking was Zoe and it was the direct to consumer where that is the interface, there's not an intermediary or real retailer at certain points. And hearing from that, whether it's the contact center, whether it's social media, whether it's that the people that are on that front line, they're co creating customer experience. How have you seen companies make that move from viewing the contact center as this cost center to a customer insights center like you're describing a revenue generator How are you seeing companies make that move?

Milagros Gonzales: 9:54

Exactly so so actually like gorgeous I now work for God yes, like we A provide like unlimited seats in our platform. So people from all different areas in the company can have access to the tickets, the feedback that clients are, are leaving for the company so that way like they can access like, good feedback, but feedback reviews, everything. And the question is, what are you going to do with that feedback? Are you going to use it? Are you going to use it in your decision making process? Or are you just going to let it sit there and actually don't listen to your customer. So right now through this role, I have the possibility to to actually talk and interview many CX leaders in this space like Sophie. She's a great partner, I love her so much. And in like Amanda from love wellness CX director of love wellness, for example, she was sharing about her experience with one of their products, I think it was called something like lean queen, or something similar, don't quote me on that one. But I think it was that, like he, they received like a lot of feedback from customers saying, like, you know, what, like, we feel like this makes us feel that only tiny people are small people could access these like feeling good or wellness condition. So they listen to that feedback. And they were actually able to change the name of the product. So that has like a lot of differences, right, you have to change it, you have like inventory for hypogene. If you had like the designs, you have everything up on their website to make that sale, but being able to listen to your customers and provide a solution or like an alternative that is more aligned to your values and the experience you want to provide to your customers that is like that is the ultimate CX CX moment, right? So that CX support is like, you don't have to buy that insights anymore. Like back in the days, we will go to focus groups, we will see people in their homes and like ask them questions, and we know how much distortion there was on those answers. But nowadays, we need to do is read your reviews, go into your support platform, read those tickets and understand what's the experience that your customers are having an understanding how you can make it better. And like, the great thing is like it's not always a budget restriction. Like you don't need to break the bank to make a great CX you actually just need to care for your customers actually care.

Rick Denton: 12:35

You're you're you're talking about this, this movement from insight to action. And I talk a lot about that. So what if you have insights? Heck, I talked about this. So what if you have scores, right? Oh, yay, our score went up. Oh, boo or score went down? Well, you need to understand that the insights, you're talking about that next stage? Right. And that is the action associated with it. You've been exposed a lot of companies, you mentioned that with Amanda, and her role in pivoting to action, when you see companies do it, right. I imagine there's a lot of process discipline there. There's a lot of execution discipline there. How have you seen if it's the CX director, or the whoever is leading this kind of this interface at gorgeous? How are you seeing them influence the company to move to action to actually do something to in your example, to change the name of a product? There's a lot that goes into that how to getting that motion forward that by and how do you how have you seen that be successful? Yeah, so

Milagros Gonzales: 13:34

like, for example, there's another great brand Canadian brand harsh out there. And they're one of their core values, they have been like talking to their customers in order to design their next products. So I think like I view their story, like after almost going into bankruptcy, and like almost close to having to close the company, they like reach out to their customers or customers that have like bottom several times from them and ask them okay, what do you want from this product? If we were to launch these next product? What do you want for a out of these? And they call they make the questions, they listen. And then they take that feedback from their customers, people that have already bought that they love the brand that like they believe in that there's already a relationship there and put all of that feedback in that product design. That is the perfect way right to to actually have that customer centric culture and having that lead your decisions.

Rick Denton: 14:38

It is it's certainly great when you already have that in place. I I know that I have worked with I've consulted CX leaders and help them in organizations that don't necessarily have that buy in. I want to ask you about the tickets that you talked about. And inside of each of those tickets, there's a story there and so you either the tickets themselves or just beyond that. How are you seeing the those the unlocking, of eagerness to move forward with CX out of something like a ticket using those customer stories? Where have you seen that be successful? So

Milagros Gonzales: 15:17

actually, these years, I also had the pleasure to work with Eli ways. He like right now he's

Rick Denton: 15:24

had another CX passport guest

Milagros Gonzales: 15:27

Yes. And so he was talking about, like, for example, someone borrowed like, Father's Day present, right? And it's like, where is the present? And you offer them a refund, right? Like they are telling you that it is that birth, like a Father's Day present or their birthday. And they want like, they don't want a refund. They don't want. No, they want that present to arrive. And to make it better, right? Oh, in like, that's why a human is necessary behind the screen to assess that ticket and say, Okay, this one needs special care, like what alternative and I need to discuss tumor, especially if it's a customer that have come back several times, you know, you want to retain that customer? And how can I provide a solution that actually satisfies the needs of this customer. So it's just that it's just reading and paying attention, or like, for example, changing like, actually, you change a bad review into a positive review. Like the chances you're going to keep that this one is going to be a brand ambassador for your brand is like hey, this is like another CX lead in my ambassador program. I'm so proud of you. Kayla Castillo from Jackson she was also talking about how she was churning like bulk reviews into five star reviews. And I think that is that game of retention, right? We all know like, lifetime value is so important and how difficult it is to acquire one customer so once you acquire them once you got them to go into your web page, you got them to purchase your product, if you can retain them and make them like a loyal customer of your brand that is what you want to keep like you want to retain them and that's only through great CX.

Rick Denton: 17:23

Really, I love that and I I've told brands, or I've said this I think I've said this on the show that there's almost a temptation to say hey, why don't you disappoint a few customers so that you can restore their relationship and make it great again? Well, no, that's a bad idea. No, we never want to seek to disappoint yet what you said is so true. And I would like to maybe off air, I would love for you to introduce me so that we can hear more of those stories of the turnaround, the the that opportunity to totally restore the relationship can create such a sense of loyalty. You know, an area that has a lot of opportunity to restore relationships is travel right you've you've traveled the globe. There have been a lot of long flights, there's been a lot of hard trips and one of the things that can be very nice on a long trip is to stop down in the lounge. Take a little break in the lounge enjoy a snack enjoy a drink and so today I want to invite you to do that no drink no snack I'm sorry I don't have that through the the video screen here. But I'd like you to join me here in the first class lounge and let's have a little fun here. I'm curious what is a dream travel vacation from your past

Milagros Gonzales: 18:32

from my past so that I that I have been already

Rick Denton: 18:36

That's correct.

Milagros Gonzales: 18:39

So Italy last year I had the chance to spend three weeks in Italy with my sister another half of that trip with my friends and it was really a great destination.

Rick Denton: 18:53

Italy what a wonderful place I can see why that is the dream from your past and to be able to spend three weeks there that's really nice to do a little slower travel and probably inspired you like Italy travelers inspired me to want to spend three months three years there and really slow travel it for sure. What about going forward? What is a dream travel vacation you've not been to yet?

Milagros Gonzales: 19:15

I haven't been to the Polynesia islands. I would love to go or like even Hawaii. I haven't had the chance to go so definitely I think that side of the world really calls me.

Rick Denton: 19:27

Boy, that would be nice. It is getting out there would be delightful. Now listeners. If you are a listener. You don't know this. But if you're a viewer you may wonder well wait, why is Rick wearing a sweater and why is Meili wearing summer clothes? That's right, folks. She gets to make us all jealous down there in Argentina in the summer weather and so while I am thinking of beaches and wanting to get out there because it's cold, I see that Meili Beach is just a part of your culture and wanting to get out to Polynesian Hawaii is just part of probably who you are and wanting to get out there. I'd have to call it out though. I am jealous of your summer timeframe right now. And I wish that I were in a warmer place right now. What is we talked about Italy and one of the great things about it is the food but I don't want to leave you with that. In general what is a favorite thing of yours to eat?

Milagros Gonzales: 20:15

Yeah, I would have to say seafood Definitely. Yes. So I live in Argentina but I don't know if you know that but I'm actually from Pedro. I'm a pedo Vianne so I love my Peruvian seafood. I love sushi and all the goodies yes

Rick Denton: 20:31

that is that is awesome. Yes I have I was actually really impressed by the sea which obviously prove they're being on the coast and the seafood culture the the sushi culture is spectacular there it is really a delightful seafood cultures I could see why that would be a part of yours. Let's go the other direction what is something while you were growing up you were forced to eat but you hated as a kid?

Milagros Gonzales: 20:57

Yeah, like yes I like all of these lever I had to like my mom was always wanted me to eat lever because I was so like skinny and like didn't eat that. Like she tried to give it to me in all different kinds of ways like in soap like me lenez like no I guess like I could try it a little bit and I already knew that there was a lever on that dish and I couldn't make it now never

Rick Denton: 21:26

really there's a there's a bit of a in a host insider small one I just love that the story but I am blown away by how often liver is coming up listeners you'll realize that yeah, the episode before this one. What was the answer to the food? Uh huh. liver and onions so it is it is funny how this is coming up as a theme I have stumbled into I thought it was brussel sprouts was the world's most hated but I'm starting to realize it maybe liver and onions that is the most hated let's let's close out the lounge with travel Amelie, you have had the chance to travel the globe. You're all over the place. What is one travel item? You won't leave home without not including your passport, not including your phone?

Milagros Gonzales: 22:08

That's a great question. I think like my sunblock. I like I kind of leave my I needed every day. I love being outdoors and outside and enjoy the sun but ya have to take care of our skin. So yes, sunblock is one that I will definitely be

Rick Denton: 22:40

a wise choice Meili. Especially as I reinforce again in summer. I did have it's not Argentina, of course. But I'd have told a story where I was in Brazil on a project in winter, while I'm sorry, well, summer in Brazil winter back home. And it was nice to report back that I was sunburned on the beach while my home friends were enjoying ice and snowstorm. So yes, sunblock does matter a lot. We talked a lot about the success stories, companies that have made that successful move, either leveraging their customer insights, moving to action really making changes as a result. It's it's obvious to people like you and me that it matters that this is something that creates tangible business value. We know it yet we see plenty of examples of customer experience customer service, all sorts of scenarios where it's still not great out there. There's a lot of things that are still need improvement. Why do you think that is? Why do you think companies haven't fully embraced the need to embrace the frontline the insights, the action around improving customer experience?

Milagros Gonzales: 23:47

I think because they haven't noticed the potential of customer support and customer experience, they are still seeing these as a cost center, like this is just returns, these are just cancellations. This is and they haven't tapped into the potential to tell me this from a cost center to a revenue center, like turn a cancellation to an upsell. And that is happening every time. More and more. So I think it's just like a change in that perspective and a change on that vision that sometimes that is the most difficult thing to do. Right. Like, and I think that's one thing that CX leaders struggle in, in their organizations when the founders are not there yet and are not seeing that great opportunity from customer support. And like the key for this is to show the numbers right like this is how much sales we were generated from support like we can like encourage us we can provide all of those statistics. And we always encourage a CX leaders to show their performance and show what's the revenue that the business that they can bring to the company with these numbers. Yeah, that to backup data sessions and to get more more budgets to keep investing in customer experience. Yeah,

Rick Denton: 25:10

I'm definitely a big proponent. And there's actually it's kind of a debate in the customer experience world. And I respect actually the other side of this view, I'm more still on the side of, we still need to show the dollars we still need. And it's kind of like marketing, sometimes you can't directly tie to it, but still some sort of linkage to, like, if we do this, we achieve this result, and it will really create this revenue gain or will reduce this cost or whatever that looks like a tangible business results. I do understand the other perspective, that is, hey, look, HR doesn't have to justify their existence. Why does CX and I, I think it comes down to the the maturity of the discipline. And still the fact that right now CX is something that well, I guess, legally, you got to keep your HR department, but you don't have to keep your customer experience department. And so I think we're still on that side of proving the results. And then another sort of way of proving the results is sort of doing it yourself. And I'm kind of curious, I'm curious about gorgeous itself. On the internal perspective, you have a whole suite of customers gorgeous, has its customers as well, you may be helping them with their customers. But if you're offering this leadership to clients on how to listen and act, how does gorgeous listen to its own customers and act on what you learn?

Milagros Gonzales: 26:24

Yes, that's a great question. I fully in gorgeous, we have a pro program that is called like CSM, a client. So we like, like collaborators from different areas, we are incentivized to pick a brand and to CSM their accounts. I personally did it did that this quarter with a couple of my partners. And that has been like a great experience to actually understand how they are using the platform, how they can get it better understand why they want to they're asking for some features or why they want to make some changes or why they find it confusing. Where are our areas of opportunities, I think, yeah, I think it's a really valuable program. So everyone like if you're in legal or you're in marketing, and you're in OPS, like everyone is encouraged to CSM a product or brand and I think that that has been great just to feel more comfortable with the platform, like what we are offering what are our like, strength? Where are we do we need to improve? So So yeah, and also

Rick Denton: 27:28

uh, you know, keep going keep going also, from,

Milagros Gonzales: 27:33

from an example, actually from Amanda from love and wellness, they have like these program that everyone does customer support on I don't know, if it's monthly basis, or yearly basis, but everyone get a chance to answer tickets, and listen who to those requests. I think that is really important as well also to value the CX agents as well, like, we haven't talked about how draining can it be because at the end of the day, yes, you receive praises and good feedback as well. But most of the time, you will meet like you will need to help people with their issues with their purchase, right? These are full of emotion, sometimes this and this, like the CFA didn't have to be there and like be kind and be helpful, and try to solve these person problems. So I think that program in love wellness is a great program as well just to show appreciation to your CX team and understand the valuable job that they are doing.

Rick Denton: 28:35

That is I have this member Well, there's two memories that are coming to mind. One is it's not exactly a customer service eight. And I don't even know if this brand still does this. But I knew there was a time that 711 would for its executive team. And I don't know exactly where the line was drawn on the hierarchy. But before you could start your role, you had to perform X number of months in a 711 store, you extracted yourself from the headquarters and you worked in an actual store. And you want to talk about really understanding what you're in at that time your customers or your franchisees they're not just your customers, right? So your franchisees, your customers what they're experiencing, by my gosh being in the store. Same thing with your example of being there on the front lines. I was working for a former company and I remember a an executive coming down and working the phones and the conversation with that executive after the fact was, that's exhausting. I never want to do and he didn't mean this like I never want to do that again just sort of being exhausted. What he meant though was he could he absolutely valued and felt like he was under skilled to deliver on what the the agents are which often we see the agents perhaps is a different level in the hierarchy when really we should be flipping that hierarchy and perhaps at the co creation of experience. That's where you should have the highest value applied to it is eye opening. When an executive and forget executive, let's take that word out of it when anyone actually takes a customer phone call. Yeah. Have you seen any chat challenges with that? As far as, like, Are people afraid to say the wrong thing? Like if I'm a company right now, and I hear this episode, everything great. I want my leadership team on the phones. What do I need to watch out for? What do I need to make sure that I do so that they have a successful experience and the customers have a successful experience? I

Milagros Gonzales: 30:32

think like what we talked about, like that framework is important know, what, where are your limits? What are your policies, and in what cases you can be flexible? I think with that framework, you should be able to, to navigate the CX world, with a lot of like common sense logic and empathy. I think those are keys.

Rick Denton: 30:56

Can we talk about that a little bit to finish out Mili, I'm looking at the clock, I'm going to cheat and get running maybe a little bit long here. You started by talking about policies and breaking, or giving flexibility there, that's scary for a company. Zoe's episode actually is called the one with a profitable rule breaker. And her point was, hey, by allowing people to, you know, think like humans, you can actually increase your profits by allowing this. If you're having a conversation with one of your clients, and they're a policy heavy client, and you're saying, hey, look, you need to be more flexible, how do you help guide them to feel safe there? How do you guide them to feel comfortable going to that empowered human oriented approach?

Milagros Gonzales: 31:39

I think information and data is really valuable at this point. And that's another reason why gorgeous is. So wait, when you receive one of your clients ticket, you get to see the history of this client. So you get to see if they have purchased many times before you get to see that tickets that they got before. Maybe this is a person that always wants to return something so you know, who you are handle with. Maybe these are persons that have regularly bought for you for several years. So if you need to break a policy, you should do it because this is one of your loyal clients. So I think information like if you go blind that to make a decision, and that one email is the only thing you have, yes, probably policy. It's the right where to go. Because also there's people that want to break that always are finding like a gap in the system and how to take advantage of it and how to, you know, like, there's also that but if you have information and history on these clients, you should be able to make an informed decision and be able to, to break up quality without breaking up breaking the bank. Right.

Rick Denton: 32:47

I like that. Ooh, let's close there. That's fantastic mili if, first of all, I love that because it's not just willy nilly. We trust people, but rather with information, you can then empower and trust because you've informed your frontline love it. Mainly folks wanted to get to know more about you and your approach to customer experience. Learn more about gorgeous and the products that they offer. What's the best way for folks to get to learn more?

Milagros Gonzales: 33:12

Definitely through LinkedIn, you can find me there through like my full name actually that it's Milagros Gonzalez. Yeah. So in Lincoln, I'm always sharing like great content from the ambassador's great insights. So that will be the best place to connect.

Rick Denton: 33:30

Awesome, I will get that into the show notes. With Mili's full name and you'll be able to just click that link and go there immediately. Thank you for walking me through this conversation. This has been a lot of fun going. Understanding, especially because I love talking to someone who has the same value on the front line that recognizes that's where it matters. That's where it's really that's the goal. That's the insight, and some ideas on how a company might be able to move from viewing them as a cost center and actually into actual insights and those success stories that you've shared. Have should have inspired listeners and viewers. I know it inspired me and I'm hoping that through that we will start to see fewer and fewer of these bad customer experiences bad customer service and instead see more and more delightful and forget delightful, just good experience with our brands. Mili, it was a wonderful ride today. Thank you for being on CX Passport

Milagros Gonzales: 34:23

Thank you so much for having me big was a pleasure.

Rick Denton: 34:32

Thanks for joining us this week on CX Passport. If you liked today’s episode I have 3 quick next steps for you Click subscribe on the CX Passport youtube channel or your favorite podcast app Next leave a comment below the video or a review in your favorite podcast app so others can find and and enjoy CX Passport too Then, head over to cxpassport.com website for show notes and resources that can help you create tangible business results by delivering great customer experience. Until next time, I’m Rick Denton and I believe the best meals are served outside and require a passport.