Stephanie Coradin: 0:00

The first psychology I use there is if you trust your team members enough with information then that will make them automatically trust you.

Rick Denton: 0:15

You're listening to CX Passport, the show about creating great customer experiences with a dash of travel talk. Each episode we’ll talk with our guests about great CX, travel...and just like the best journeys, explore new directions we never anticipated. I'm your host Rick Denton. I believe the best meals are served outside and require a passport. Let's get going. Welcome back to the departures Hall CX passport travelers today. It's gonna be a little bit of a change from our typical journey as we get into an important topic that you might not immediately associate with customer experience. It is my honor to introduce you to our next guest, Stephanie Corden, a dynamic force and leadership training, executive coaching and mental health advocacy. Stephanie bodies a holistic approach to leadership, recognising the profound connection between mental wellness and customer experience, as a mental health counselor turned to CEO and founder of Dembo Inc. Stephanie's journey is defined by her commitment to nurturing both the emotional well being of individuals and the operational excellence of organizations. Stephanie's journey encompasses roles at Orkin pest control and Seminole Hard Rock Hotel and Casino, where she honed her skills in operations management and leadership development. recognized as one of the top 15 trainers in hospitality for 2021 by the International Hospitality Institute. Stephanie is a pioneer in bridging the gap between corporate leaders and their teams. So let's explore that intersection of mental health, leadership development, customer experience with Stephanie today, learn how prioritizing mental wellness within organizations not only fosters employee satisfaction and loyalty, but also translates into exceptional customer interactions and heightened brand perception. Stephanie, welcome to CX passport.

Stephanie Coradin: 2:19

Thank you so much for having me, Rick. And what a beautiful introduction. I appreciate it.

Rick Denton: 2:24

Well, it is a beautiful background and a beautiful history that makes for a beautiful introduction. So I'm eager to have you on the show today. You know, we're gonna go other directions today, I really do want to focus with that, that topic that we don't talk about on the show all that much and really, as a society haven't talked about as much as we should, although in the last year's maybe decade or so we've talked more about it. So let's start with that focus on mental health and leadership. What drew you to link those two together? And then how do you apply that to your business practice?

Stephanie Coradin: 2:55

Sure, sure. So what drew me to what drew me to link those two together, started with me in hospitality as a learning and development director, trying to move away from cookie cutter cutter ways of doing training and cookie cutter ways of understanding people, right. And if I back up a little bit, I had the brilliant idea that I would leave hospitality for a little while and I went into mental health counseling, I got my master's degree, and I worked as a counselor for two years, not leaving hospitality quite yet just as a part time thing gig. And I found a wealth of information. I can always link back to my work, you know, as a leadership development, trainer and coach. And that's when I realized that I can always use these tips and tricks and theories and frameworks to bring back into creating trainings that were less cookie cutter and more for the environment that I was in, right. Yeah, for example, just because a hotel is a hotel does it mean a hotel on South Beach should be the people at a hotel in South Beach, I should say should be trained the same as the people at a hotel in West Palm Beach. So South Beach, you have a party area, people are on vacation, they want to drink, they want a party. So the team members that are you know, helping those guests should be trained a little bit differently than in West Palm Beach where it's slower, it's calmer. You get a lot of retirees. You get snowbirds, people who have retired who live up north and come down south when it's cold. So it's two different mindsets, two different worlds pretty much so it's people shouldn't be trained. for customer service the same way in those two environments, and that's when I figured that out, I realized that mental wellness and the way we think the way we project our emotions have a lot to do with the way we should be training our team members. Okay,

Rick Denton: 5:17

that last part really caught me because I was thinking, okay, so I can, I can see how a uniqueness and training would be important between those two worlds, right? Absolutely. South Beach versus West, I thought you were gonna say something like, you know, going to South Dakota or something like that. So, certainly a difference there. The then you started to get into though, and it is that mental approach that you are taking into that role, not just the uniqueness of the training. And So walk me through a little bit of that, how can that focus on mental health influence how a company or in the case of you're describing here an individual, deliver that experience for a customer? Sure, sure.

Stephanie Coradin: 5:56

So what I owe with the example that I use, a lot of times when I when I balance those two is the what somebody is expecting to find in South Beach is not what they're expecting to find when they go to West Palm Beach. So the team member, even though it might be that same team member that travels from South Beach to West Palm Beach has to do that pivot, you know, that mindset shift, right. And it's important to teach the team member how to do that pivot, because you don't want a team member that's expecting a slow night to fall like to stumble upon a busy night, that wouldn't be South Beach, or the craziness that would be South Beach, without them knowing what they're walking into, immediately when the person is not expecting that they're going to be dealing with 120 drunks versus, you know, 50 people who are just looking to be chill and relaxed, right? Their anxiety goes up, right. And as soon as they're feeling overwhelmed, the work is not going to be the same. They're either going to add in a state, it's, it brings it up a state of fight or flight, right. So they're either going to be frustrated, and that's going to show in their service, or they're going to freeze and that too, is going to show in their service.

Rick Denton: 7:21

I would imagine that, no, I shouldn't lead with that. I feel like I'm leading the witness. Your honor. I'm curious, because mental health, a lot of that is the state in which you sort of walk into how healthy are you kind of coming into that. And I imagine that has some sort of effect on that delivery because of experience, not just the switching back and forth. Let's say that you're always the south beach person, and you are the life of the party. But how how can someone really focus on their mental health in a way that helps them deliver customer experience so that when they're going into whatever their situation is whether any situation? Any work scenario? What is it that they need to be doing it from a mental health perspective so that they can deliver great customer experience?

Stephanie Coradin: 8:05

That is an awesome question. And it is a simple answer. On the surface, right? Self awareness, right? When the person is fully grounded, and they fully take the time to understand who they are, and how they operate, then no matter what environment they walk into, they are going to thrive because they can stay in their power and their groundedness. But that is also a training that is also coaching that needs to happen. And that is like a bigger conversation or training we should say. So to start with, we want to suggest that hey, this person, you should know this is the environment that you're going into which we should always do whether or not that we know that the person is mentally ready for an environment, we should still tell them that this is the environment you're going into. But what I find is when the person is mentally healthy, then they're grounded. They're if they fully know who they are and how they operate as a person, then the environment won't shake them too much.

Your CX Passport Captain: 9:15

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Stephanie Coradin: 9:41

so this is what I stand for now, this is the thing that I'm shouting from the roof talks, right? You should definitely, as a business, as a company, be more aware and make sure that your team members are aware. But to answer your question, how can we bring that into the company? How can we make sure my way of doing it right now is just telling them basically, hey, you know, you have a culture problem, or you have an environment problem that is bigger than the little conflict resolution that you had before, or the standard operating procedure that you're looking for me to do. And this is why I'm saying it, this is how we can fix it. So pretty much laying it out in a convincing way and showing them that if they go this route, if it's more self aware, if there's more transparency, if there's more communication, then the bottom line is bound to grow. Because when you're when your team members understand their role, they tend to take their role, their leadership more seriously, their self leadership. Right. So once they understand their roles in what's happening, then everything falls into place, and businesses make more money.

Rick Denton: 11:48

And, and that is something that will listen to certainly have heard me preach about as tangible business results, right? This isn't fluffernutter mental health is not something that is just Well, it's kind and we're humans, and that's a good part, right? We are kind of humans, however, CFOs? Well, CFOs can be kind of human, I mean to say that, but the business is in the business of being profitable besides contact and how this can improve and address that. Let's let's do a pivot because you did have that that deep stint there and hospitality was certainly an iconic brand, in the hardrock brand, and then you know, other elements in that hospitality space. With all of those years of hospitality experience in your past? How does that carry forward into how you approach customer experience today?

Stephanie Coradin: 12:31

So one of the things that I like to say is that I started in hospitality when I was 17, as a server, and then I went and became a bartender, and then I moved into hotels as a desk agent, and then I worked my way up from there. So I've pretty much been in customer service my entire life. And obviously, if you know anything about guest services, you know, customers can, right. So that's the mentality that even when like even though I teach team members now how to approach it in a more holistic view, as opposed to just whatever the guest wants, or whatever the customer wants, that is the foundation for me, right? Making the customer happy. So that's where that comes from.

Rick Denton: 13:17

Yeah, I imagined. Well, I don't I've said here, I'm tempted to ask, maybe we'll just touch on it. I have to imagine that as a bartender, you really learned and it's stereotypical, but you really learn some of those listening skills, the empathy skills that we value so much in in our frontline, customer. Contact roles and not just contact but retail frontline serve, whatever that looks like. Yeah. Was that something that you felt like was ingrained in you? Or is it something that you felt growing in you as you were in that bartender role? So

Stephanie Coradin: 13:54

I, for me, I think that I had started with my listening, and I guess I like to call it my psychology skills a little bit earlier. But definitely, I say, as a bartender, I was an unofficial therapist, right? Because people come and they told me stories that I had no business knowing that

Rick Denton: 14:18

we're gonna do another podcast called bartender secrets.

Stephanie Coradin: 14:24

Yes, I would say that that was where I started to grow my in hone my skills, my listening skills, my understanding skills, and my communication skills all together.

Rick Denton: 14:36

Yeah, and I imagined Okay, so there's a question that I want to ask you and I did not expect it to relate to bartending, but I think it may come back to this because one of the things about bartending is not only are you there to listen, you're there to do a job and I imagine in a crowded, you know, maybe Friday night, whatever that looks like, yeah, you're gonna be empathetic but she also got a job to do and I had posted back In February, I posted a video on LinkedIn about a really poor customer service experience that I'd had with a home services platform. And not only did they fail on the actual task, the customer service experience after the failure of the task was just infuriating. I got peppered with all of these faux empathy phrases. Yeah. Oh, I'm I'm, I can tell why you would be so upset by that. I can appreciate why that would be a concern to you. And I'm like, taking deep breaths. And then a phrase like, well, We'll reschedule you at no cost. Oh, my head exploded because I'm like, so yeah, it's yours fault. Of course, it'd be no cost. In fact, you need to give my money back. And so I had this empathy, but it was faux empathy. And the job wasn't getting done. Also, channeling kind of thinking back to the bartender, really just sort of, in general, we have all this focus on customer service be like me that consultants, podcast, there's training, there's all that all these tools that exist around customer experience. And yet Stephanie, why is customer service still so poor?

Stephanie Coradin: 16:06

So one of the reasons that comes up for me, as you were saying that, and I talk about it a lot, is the box that we tend to put our team members in, right. So you see those words, those faux empathy that that person was giving you to probably something that he clicks, or she clicks. And it tells her step by step, this is what you say first, and then this is what you say, and then they just copy and paste it. And then or they say it, you know, if it's over the phone, they just read it out to you, because they're in this little box, and they don't feel like they can come out of that box, or, you know, stray away from what they are told to save. And one of the things that I always fight with hotels more specifically with is when the front desk tells you like you rent a room for, you know, I don't know, $400 a night, let's say right, and then something happens. And the Front Desk Agent is like, Oh, my apologies, we can credit you $25 And you're like, what? I just spent $1,200. And you're talking about crediting me $25? What is that going to do? But the thing is, that's the only thing that they can do, you know, unless they go to a supervisor or a higher up. So one of the things that I always try to fight for is to give team members more leeway, you know, allow them to be able to go, I don't want to say fail, but go off and experiment. And at least you know, fail in a way that's not going to obviously hurt the company, but let them explore what they can do how they would want somebody to help them, right. That's some of the training that I help people with. Now, you and

Rick Denton: 17:54

I share a very similar philosophy there, around equip. And empower is such an overused word, but still just, you know, allow the people to be human a bit. And you're right. It does sound like I'm Agent blaming here. And I know that that agent was doing exactly what you just said script script script, probably while they were being asked to perform 10 chats at the same time. So why with with the realization that customers are actually choosing companies, I fired this company, I will not do business, and I'm choosing companies based off of their actual customer service experience. Why wouldn't accompany allow an agent to do what you're describing? Or maybe more positively? How have you seen companies evolved to where they are allowing that hotel front desk to behave in the way that you're describing? Yes.

Stephanie Coradin: 18:43

So lately, I've been seeing more and more of that, but not to, you know, I don't want to stereotype or categorize. But what I've noticed is the hotels that have been here for a long time that have been very much, you know, profitable and just have been doing things the way they've been doing it, they have the mentality of if it's not broke, don't fix it type of thing. And that's what's holding them back a little bit in that sense, because they already know they're established and people are going to come and you know, these team members are going to do what they tell them to do. And they feel like they have more control over the team members when they are telling them, Hey, you can only credit this person $25 You can't stray from that, hey, this is what you this is a script. This is what you need to tell them. So it's it's a way of control. And what I found lately is the companies that are starting smaller, like the boutique hotels, the ends and stuff like that, they're a little bit more laid back in that sense. They're a little bit more willing and open to exploring. And as I say that there are some big hotel chains that are becoming more lenient But that's because their team members that are coming on are a little bit more rebellious sodas. Hey, all right. Yeah. So they're doing it a little bit their way. And people, the managers, the executives are finding that that way that they're just doing it instead of waiting for a supervisor, they're just taking on the chance to do something and they like to use the word I made an executive decision, right? And then they literally do that I've like, I've gotten concerns from HR saying, hey, these people are making executive decisions with it. They're not supposed to how do we stop them? But what they're seeing is, those executive decisions are making customers happy.

Rick Denton: 20:50

There were a couple of things that came to mind there when you said, Well, things are working just fine. Oh, there's no reason to change. We're highly profitable. Blockbuster, and so that's the first one they gave me. The second one is actually a former CX passport guests. So econ, she talked about the profitable rule breaker. And when you talk about the rebels coming in, and the idea was okay, we break a few rules, it's profitable. It's all right for the company, if we bend a few rules and then create the customer loyalty, it really is, it's a challenge. Like, you know, somebody listening is like, okay, right, that's really nice to say on a podcast, definitely, that's really nifty. It can be kind of hard. And so I know there's a lot of nuance to that. Sometimes I do want to get our heads spinning and somebody wants to take a little break. And so I invite you to take that little break with Hey, we're gonna stop down here in the first class lounge move a little quickly here and have a little bit of fun. What is the dream travel location from your past? From

Stephanie Coradin: 21:44

my past? I would have to say it's always Haiti. I love going to Haiti. And right it's always a dream travel location for me.

Rick Denton: 21:53

That's fantastic. I think hey, you may be my first Haiti answer. What is it about Haiti that draws you?

Stephanie Coradin: 21:59

So? I don't know I just feel at home and I love that

Rick Denton: 22:04

there's something about when travel equals home it's the not home but it's the home

Stephanie Coradin: 22:09

yeah, home that you don't have to pay bills that you're disconnected from everything.

Rick Denton: 22:16

Well, I don't know if this is gonna feel like home but what is a dream travel vacation? You've not been to yet?

Stephanie Coradin: 22:22

A gym travel location, I just added Santorini to my bucket list.

Rick Denton: 22:27

Okay. I don't think I need to ask why. But I still am going to what's drawing you to Santorini

Stephanie Coradin: 22:35

I'm an island girl at heart so wherever eautiful Blue Waters I'm drawn and I saw like this retreat style home that my cousin actually he's like, I know you'd love this and I saw this retreat style home and it's overlooking the water and it's just beautiful. I'm like yeah, this is this is someplace I need to get to.

Rick Denton: 22:57

Alright, well we got Haiti we got Santorini Yeah, I see the islands and absolutely what is a favorite thing of yours to eat? Pizza? Okay,

Stephanie Coradin: 23:07

no question.

Rick Denton: 23:09

We're not going to have another conversation about it pizza indeed. gone the other way. What is something you were forced to eat as you were growing up but you hated as a kid?

Stephanie Coradin: 23:21

I was forced to eat as I would have to say grits and yellow grits. Yeah, but I love it now Billy

Rick Denton: 23:30

Oh, okay. Now even as a kid I loved my girl right and so I can see the texture whatever yeah that kind of big as a kid No, I loved it back then. That's funny. What is one travel item not including your phone not including your passport that you will not leave home with

Stephanie Coradin: 23:47

so i You said one travel item but I have this little travel bag right that I put everything that I think is essential in there in that little bag if I leave it My world is crumbling

Rick Denton: 24:09

it's definitely I've got a travel it sits in my closet said when it's time to travel, just grab it, drop it in. So I understand that approach. I've duplicated so many items so that I think about packing to scrap drop it in boom. Yep. I want to go back to kind of that employee the leadership aspect of things you know so much of your work centers on leadership and the connection or Well, the disconnection with employees. It's, I know it's cliche, but often employees feel like there's this lack of communication, which then creates this lack of respect for their leaders. Why is that still occurring? How are you teaching leaders to communicate with their teams?

Stephanie Coradin: 24:48

So why is it still occurring is the same reason we were talking about earlier about if it's not broke, don't fix it. We still have that mentality that on a need to know base That's right. Oh, they don't need to know about that, or, Oh, that's too much information to provide. And what I've seen that's happened so many times is just that little bit of information that we thought might be too much information is the reason why the team member is not doing the job fully, because they just don't fully understand what they need to be doing to reach that goal with you. Right. So one of the things that I do now is, make sure I hone in or I drill in my leaders head that communication is key. And the the, I guess, reverse psychology I use there is if you trust your team members enough with information, then that will make them automatically trust you. And that's where the respect comes in. And that's where the, you know, they start to own their role in the in the, in the position that they're in because they understand what's happening more and more. And I found that that's worked, like, the Trust has to be mutual. It can't be Oh, I'm the manager, you're the employee, you have to trust me, whatever I say goes. That's not how human nature works. So

Rick Denton: 26:10

yeah, no, it's certainly not like, that feels like a workstyle that we as humans were willing to put up with a century ago, but it certainly doesn't apply now. Now, you said something about kind of that little nugget that enabled the employee to do their job? And absolutely, like that piece of communication that unlocked something that's good. I imagine, though, that even the leader that desires to communicate, there is this tension that, you know, we talked about, we want full transparency, and we hear that a lot, that though, can have a mixed impact on the employee experience? How are you helping folks balance that those extremes of full transparency, everything is known? And then leadership holding everything close to the vest? Yes,

Stephanie Coradin: 26:56

that is an awesome question as well. Right. So I do not fall into the full transparency category. I don't believe that people need to know, every single thing that is happening inside of a company, I think that would cause dumpster fires all the time people panic, you know, there would cause anxiety, right? So what I do is to have my leaders find a happy medium, right? What's the balance between telling them enough? Telling them what they need to know, as opposed to just telling them, you know, all the skeletons in the closet? So for me, that is, how comfortable? Are you telling them x? And let's tell them why. Right? Yeah. If stopping at x is what's uncomfortable for you, or what's comfortable for you? Let's take it a step further and tell them why. But let's not tell them Z. Because then we're getting into their story that is not necessary that skeleton in the closet territory, okay. categorized

Rick Denton: 28:04

kind of go to go to your discomfort point. Really well, let's go back to something you said earlier in the episode, become self aware, I realized I'm trying to different self awareness is true, be self aware as to am I just uncomfortable? Because I'm a little more of a controlling person, or really no, this is information that shouldn't be out there and then understand the why behind it, and realize where those boundaries are. Exactly. You, you've said something and I may want to close with this. But it is it was this idea of you know, that's the way things have always been. That's the why why is customer service the way it is? Why why why is communication out there? What does it take for a company to break out of that? Well, that's the way we've always done it. And especially when it comes to customer experience, because the nurture is strong here. How can accompany not do it the way they've always done it, and use that as a way to improve customer experience. So

Stephanie Coradin: 29:02

that is one of the hardest things that we've had to do, right? Getting a company or their leaders, the executives to break out of that's the way we've always done it. But the way that I've found that works mostly is because one they will call if I mean obviously for me to go into a company, I have to get that call, they'd have to see a need, right? So once they see that need, that's my you know, leeway my entry point to get them to understand that whatever that you're looking at that conflict that you see or that issue with customer service that you see, it's deeper. Let's dig in let's find what it is right. So a lot of times me being able to show them the real beta of me doing interviews with their teams or even sometimes if necessary with their guests in a certain way. Or customers I say guests because hotel, with their customers or clients in on a certain level. It has helped for me to get data to show that, hey, this is where we are now. And this is where we can be if we fix the cause of your issues as opposed to trying to fix the symptoms. Because conflict, you calling me in to do a conflict resolution training is just slapping a BandAid on a deeper issue. And that's where we need to be. Let's

Rick Denton: 30:24

close there. Because Exactly. So I may help you with a little bit of conflict resolution, but it's why is this conflict continuing to arise? What will it take for us to get to that point, understanding what that looks like? Stephanie, if folks want to get to know a little bit more about you, the services, you offer your perspective on mental health and its application to leadership, your hospitality experience, customer experience, leadership, development, all that, what's the best way for folks to get to know a little bit more about you? Sure,

Stephanie Coradin: 30:53

they can go to my website at seven bol inc.com. And that's DMBOI mc.com. And I'm on LinkedIn at Stephan Coloradan. I'm also on Instagram and Facebook on it's definitely crowded.

Rick Denton: 31:07

All right, well, I will get all of that into the show notes as folks know who you are accustomed to not hitting pause, but rather just scrolling down clicking the link and interacting with Stephanie in that way, Stephanie did really enjoy this like it really was when you and I first met, I didn't really know how a mental health conversation. I don't want to say that I didn't know how it would apply to customer experience. But really drawing us into that and understanding that sense of self awareness being so vital into the employee, and then the company's willingness to appreciate that self awareness, and then how that carries that hospitality experience and how it cascades into communication and beyond. This has been a fun, a fun journey with you.

Stephanie Coradin: 31:45

Thank you. I've

Rick Denton: 31:46

learned quite a bit. Yes, definitely. Awesome. Well, Stephanie, thank you for being on CX password.

Stephanie Coradin: 31:51

I appreciate it.

Rick Denton: 31:58

Thanks for joining us this week on CX Passport. If you liked today’s episode I have 3 quick next steps for you Click subscribe on the CX Passport youtube channel or your favorite podcast app Next leave a comment below the video or a review in your favorite podcast app so others can find and and enjoy CX Passport too Then, head over to cxpassport.com website for show notes and resources that can help you create tangible business results by delivering great customer experience. Until next time, I’m Rick Denton and I believe the best meals are served outside and require a passport.